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Re: Y Store /Closures

   On Fri, 2003-02-28 at 08:57, Sundar Narasimhan wrote:
   >    What is the minimal piece of Java or XML or Python that shows the same
   >    kind of executable step-by-step definition of a task as I gave in my post?
   > Avi: You've gone from "cannot be done" to "cannot be done in as many
   > lines of code". I won't take that bait, Sorry. Because the lines of
   > code you are focussed on reducing is not what I (and other enterprise
   > developers are focused on -- supporting the back button in the manner
   > you describe is less than 5% of my use-cases).

   You know, as a huge Zope lover, let me chip in my 2 cents.  I think you
   take another look at Avi's approach, and think about it more deeply
   before dismissing it so quickly.

I'm not dismissing it. Apologies if I gave that impression. Web
applications are complex (to me at least) beasts. Not the least
because on the front-end they involve people who's skills I'm barely
beginning ot appreciate :)

   ones I write in Scheme.  Avi is talking about a conceptual jump as big
   as the jump from 'goto' to structured programming, or the jump from
   structured programming to object-oriented programming.  It's not
   something you can grok without hands-on experience.

Ok. What is the framework that Avi is talking about / where can one
get such hands-on experience? Don't get me wrong -- I perfectly
understand the benefits of what certain languages can provide in the
back-end. It's just that I don't think some of the ones that people
have mentioned are indispensable (yet), mainly because I've been
benchmarking our performance wrt. some of these, and back-end server
programming seems to go pretty quickly with the tools that are out
there now.. perhaps I'm missing something.  (We didn't switch to
struts btw, until we could set break points visually and hot-code
replace within the container -- so I understand perfectly what one can do
w/ Lisp-like environments :)